Συζήτηση βοήθειας:Πρότυπα ύφους

μειωτικοί όροι vs. υβριστικοί όροι

@Sarri.greek Hey, I need your help what’s the difference between μειωτικοί and υβριστικοί όροι? I am updating the term nigger which is an extremely offensive word in English, arguably the most offensive word and it’s labeled with {{ετ|μειωτικό|en}} right now. On en.wiki, it has the tag offensive. Whichever is more offensive of either {{ετ|μειωτικό|en}} or {{ετ|υβριστικό|en}} is what we should use for that term. Or is there another tag that I am missing that more closely translates to offensive?

Thanks for your help! Stephilippou (συζήτηση) 16:50, 17 Ιανουαρίου 2024 (UTC)

@FocalPoint I just noticed you saw this. I would also love your opinion too not only Sarri’s! Stephilippou (συζήτηση) 18:13, 17 Ιανουαρίου 2024 (UTC)

Καλησπέρα @Stephilippou. Your request is well timed. I do not know whether you have noticed that with the encouragement of @Ah3kal, we have discussed a new thematic week - see discussion in Συζήτηση βικιλεξικού:Θεματικές Εβδομάδες/39 and the actual page in Βικιλεξικό:Θεματικές Εβδομάδες/39, it will be a week dedicated to αθυροστομία.

• υβριστικός όρος is an actual swear word. Νigger does not count as a swear word for me, because I am taking into account the greek translation νέγρος, which means mainly a black person. See examples in Κατηγορία:Υβριστικοί όροι (νέα ελληνικά). One of them is μαλάκας. It can be used casually, but it is definitely a swear word. In understand that in today's context, nigger is perceived as a swear word.
• μειωτικός όρος is a debasing word, which is used to look down on somebody like γεροξεκούτης, as well as αράπης, the equivalent to nigger in Κατηγορία:Μειωτικοί όροι (νέα ελληνικά). A μειωτικός όρος is definitely "softer" than an υβριστικός.

I hope I answered your question.

Do not hesitate to contribute to the development of the Βικιλεξικό:Θεματικές Εβδομάδες/39, for the week dedicated to αθυροστομία. You will be welcome ! FocalPoint (συζήτηση) 23:20, 17 Ιανουαρίου 2024 (UTC)

Ααααα.. @Stephilippou, έχουμε και την Κατηγορία:Κακόσημοι όροι (νέα ελληνικά) ! FocalPoint (συζήτηση) 23:23, 17 Ιανουαρίου 2024 (UTC)

oh dear... we also have Κατηγορία:Χλευαστικοί όροι (νέα ελληνικά) ... ! This is probably too much. FocalPoint (συζήτηση) 23:26, 17 Ιανουαρίου 2024 (UTC)

@FocalPoint oh yeah, “nigger” is a swear word. You definitely can’t say that in English without making many people angry. It’s likely the worst swear word if you did a ranking of swear words. νέγρος to me seems more like negro which is not nearly as offensive. Anyway, I think I’ll change the label to {{ετ|υβριστικό|en}} on the lemma because the english word is highly offensive.

Also, I agree there are too many overlapping categories and I’m not sure the difference always but I’ll use {{ετ|υβριστικό|en}} for highly offensive things that would get you fired from a job and {{ετ|μειωτικό|en}} for things that, while rude, are not going to get your fired. Stephilippou (συζήτηση) 23:32, 17 Ιανουαρίου 2024 (UTC)

@FocalPoint Also my understanding for {{ετ|κακόσημο|en}} is that it’s a word that’s “disapproving” (which is the term Oxford uses a lot). For example, I just did idle which can mean someone is lazy (τεμπέλης). See the first σημασία in idle - Oxford Learner's Dictionaries. This is definitely not a swear word like υβριστικό but it’s not an insult like I believe μειωτικό can be. It’s just a little bit rude and can be seen as not as nice or polite of a thing to say but it’s not really an insult.

Let me know what your thoughts are on this but this is how I understand them and have been editing the English lemma according to these “rules”.

Thanks, Stephilippou (συζήτηση) 23:38, 17 Ιανουαρίου 2024 (UTC)

@Stephilippou, the "will it get you fired?" criterion is a good one. I agree that it can serve as a rule of thumb to identify the worst ones.

Yes, νέγρος is closer to negro.

For κακόσημο, the etymology gives the best clue - something that has a bad meaning. I think that it is worth examining these categories in the course of the initiative to simplify Wiktionary. FocalPoint (συζήτηση) 06:04, 18 Ιανουαρίου 2024 (UTC)

Έχουμε κάτι για humorous?

@FocalPoint Hi, do we have a label for humorous in Greek? or should I create one and what is the best Greek translation, κωμικός? There is one on en.wiki, wikt:Category:Humorous terms by language also. Stephilippou (συζήτηση) 14:02, 13 Μαρτίου 2024 (UTC)

@Stephilippou, I checked and we have it: See in Module:auto_cat/data/style, the

• Σκωπτικοί όροι-> {ετ|σκωπτ}
• Σκωπτικές σημασίες όρων -> {ετ|σκωπτ σημ}

In fact, the term σκωπτικός fits better than κωμικός. Κωμικός in my mind is closer to funny than to humorous, so σκωπτικός it is and we have it ! FocalPoint (συζήτηση) 17:48, 13 Μαρτίου 2024 (UTC)

@Stephilippou, I also connected the Κατηγορία:Σκωπτικοί όροι (νέα ελληνικά) with en:wikt:Category:Greek humorous terms. FocalPoint (συζήτηση) 17:52, 13 Μαρτίου 2024 (UTC)

@FocalPoint Amazing that’s perfect thanks! I saw σκωπτικός=scoptic was the translation but I had no idea what that word is because I’ve never heard it in English. It looks like it’s an obsolete word in English that was derived from Greek at some point but no one uses anymore. In my Greek-English dictionary, it translates σκωπτικός=mocking/taunting/satirical which is a good way to describe the meaning of humorous so I agree that’s a good translation. Stephilippou (συζήτηση) 18:03, 13 Μαρτίου 2024 (UTC)